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Heritage Ending Almost all Arch Top Production According to Wolfe Guitars Facebook Post


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Hello everyone, longtime no see.  This Facebook post by Jay Wolfe about Heritage curtailing production of most of its models, particularly the arch tops, started a lot of discussion over on the Jazzguitar.be forum.  The usual Heritage haters weighed in quick to celebrate.  I have pretty strong feelings about what this means for the company going forward, but am curious as to all of your opinions:

 

Recent changes at 225 Parsons Street-
Things rarely remain the same, and change is inevitable. The Heritage management are very intent on improving quality and have decided to somewhat limit model availability for a limited period. Beginning Feb. 1, 2018 only 6 models are being made: H137, H150, H530, H535, H575, Eagle Classic- all in several colors BUT no customization for the time being. Fortunately we have a fine selection of those popular models currently not being made- including- Super Eagle, Golden Eagle, Sweet 16, Spruce top H575, H575 Custom, H525, H555, H157, Millennium H155, etc.
Are any of the Company founders still there? Yes, including Jim, Bill and some of their long time employees like Ren, Pete Farmer & some others.
How’s the quality? Well, Heritage always made solid guitars that sound vintage & great. Their fit & finish & setups often varied from just ok to pretty darned awful. As their largest Dealer, we simply corrected the poor setups (old Gibson habits), and the finish glitches OR sent them back as simply unacceptable. Most Heritage fans were aware of this and OK with it to some degree or another. When Heritage changed hands a few years back, the new guys took time to listen to complaints and vowed to improve. They did, and fit, finish and setup has improved dramatically in the past few years. Some of the biggest improvements involve the old historical physical plant, which the Heritage guys struggled with for 3 decades- including improved HVAC, lighting, electrical, dust control, spray booth and so many other critical areas. The changes were remarkable costly and appreciated.
The new owners have now partnered with a large Global Distribution Company, who are charged with sales, marketing and Export distribution. Those folks have an even higher expectation & standard for QC, and it’s their intent to improve QC even more! We felt it was plenty fine as it was in 2016/2017 BUT we certainly support this impressive effort to improve further. We are excited for our future with Heritage Guitars and are keen to see & play 2018 models, with the focus on even finer QC. Improving an already great Guitar can’t be bad.
So, stay tuned, check out our inventory, and please keep the faith. Heritage and Wolfe Guitars appreciate your loyalty and business.
Sincerely, Jay Wolfe."

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I was wondering myself if it could be due to inexperience on the part of the newer employees. Making an archtop is much more labor intensive and requires a considerable increase in skill level, versus making a solid body guitar. Also, not sure how much involvement the original guys like Marv, Jim and Bill are working hands on anymore. In the meantime, I think I might place an order for a Marv-Bird!

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...it's a strange feeling right now- the future of the company and how everything is going to turn out seems very "up in the air." Ultimately change does always have to happen- so the Heritage Company we've all come to know and love will really never be the same, because it can't be. Time moves on and new hands and faces get involved. Marv, Jim, Bill, Ren and the original guys aren't as involved as they once were, and that's understandable- again- time rolls on and change has to happen. That does not mean that Heritage can't still be a great guitar company though- they will just ultimately be a DIFFERENT company....

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I watched the Premier Guitar video at NAMM with Pete.

Here's what I took out of it.  The H150, H535, and H137 are now the Standard Series.

Pete was showing off custom made guitars and talking about the capability for custom guitars.

To me, that implies there may yet be some hope the Archtops and other higher models haven't ceased production, but become more of Custom Shop versus Standard Series.

Just my thought, but we will see.

For Reference:

 

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I posted this in the Heritage at NAMM thread.

I suspect that this is temporary. Heritage is partnering with a different marketing and distribution company in the USA and abroad. I really can't see Heritage totally getting rid of ALL of the semi hollows and archtops that they are famous for. But I can see this as a temporary strategy to gain more market penetration.

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Matt...good to see you're still upright and taking nourishment!  Hope all's well with you!  Not really an arch top player, per se, I do have a custom ordered Super Eagle.  It's an incredible example of the luthier's art!  I've always loved the inherent grace and beauty of arch tops, and what accomplished players (like Matt) could do with them.  And compared to what the equivalent Gibson would have cost ten years ago, I stole my Super (thanks, Jay)!  It's clear that Heritage couldn't continue to build high-end, labor and skill intensive instruments and virtually give them away.  I also don't think it's clear that Heritage has abandoned the building of arch tops, categorically.  We might hope that as they retool, figure out what their market is, and how to address that market's requirements that they'll return to something they did extraordinarily well and had over almost every other builder.  I'd hate to see the art, craft and tradition of a rare and beautiful skill die at the hands of "market forces."  

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Recent changes at 225 Parsons Street-
Things rarely remain the same, and change is inevitable. The Heritage management are very intent on improving quality and have decided to somewhat limit model availability
for a limited period. Beginning Feb. 1, 2018 only 6 models are being made: H137, H150, H530, H535, H575, Eagle Classic- all in several colors BUT no customization for the time being. Fortunately we have a fine selection of those popular models currently not being made- including- Super Eagle, Golden Eagle, Sweet 16, Spruce top H575, H575 Custom, H525, H555, H157, Millennium H155, etc. Are any of the Company founders still there? Yes, including Jim, Bill and some of their long time employees like Ren, Pete Farmer & some others. How’s the quality? Well, Heritage always made solid guitars that sound vintage & great. Their fit & finish & setups often varied from just ok to pretty darned awful. As their largest Dealer, we simply corrected the poor setups (old Gibson habits), and the finish glitches OR sent them back as simply unacceptable. Most Heritage fans were aware of this and OK with it to some degree or another. When Heritage changed hands a few years back, the new guys took time to listen to complaints and vowed to improve. They did, and fit, finish and setup has improved dramatically in the past few years. Some of the biggest improvements involve the old historical physical plant, which the Heritage guys struggled with for 3 decades- including improved HVAC, lighting, electrical, dust control, spray booth and so many other critical areas. The changes were remarkable costly and appreciated.
The new owners have now partnered with a large Global Distribution Company, who are charged with sales, marketing and Export distribution. Those folks have an even higher expectation & standard for QC, and it’s their intent to improve QC even more! We felt it was plenty fine as it was in 2016/2017 BUT we certainly support this impressive effort to improve further. We are excited for our future with Heritage Guitars and are keen to see & play 2018 models, with the focus on even finer QC. Improving an already great Guitar can’t be bad.
So, stay tuned, check out our inventory, and please keep the faith. Heritage and Wolfe Guitars appreciate your loyalty and business.
Sincerely, Jay Wolfe."

 

 

This is not the end of anything. They are going to make the "standard  line" for a few month in order to supply the new dealers with  guitars. After that they will return to making the other models and custom orders.

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8 hours ago, notbillgelder said:

Recent changes at 225 Parsons Street-
Things rarely remain the same, and change is inevitable. The Heritage management are very intent on improving quality and have decided to somewhat limit model availability
for a limited period. Beginning Feb. 1, 2018 only 6 models are being made: H137, H150, H530, H535, H575, Eagle Classic- all in several colors BUT no customization for the time being. Fortunately we have a fine selection of those popular models currently not being made- including- Super Eagle, Golden Eagle, Sweet 16, Spruce top H575, H575 Custom, H525, H555, H157, Millennium H155, etc. Are any of the Company founders still there? Yes, including Jim, Bill and some of their long time employees like Ren, Pete Farmer & some others. How’s the quality? Well, Heritage always made solid guitars that sound vintage & great. Their fit & finish & setups often varied from just ok to pretty darned awful. As their largest Dealer, we simply corrected the poor setups (old Gibson habits), and the finish glitches OR sent them back as simply unacceptable. Most Heritage fans were aware of this and OK with it to some degree or another. When Heritage changed hands a few years back, the new guys took time to listen to complaints and vowed to improve. They did, and fit, finish and setup has improved dramatically in the past few years. Some of the biggest improvements involve the old historical physical plant, which the Heritage guys struggled with for 3 decades- including improved HVAC, lighting, electrical, dust control, spray booth and so many other critical areas. The changes were remarkable costly and appreciated.
The new owners have now partnered with a large Global Distribution Company, who are charged with sales, marketing and Export distribution. Those folks have an even higher expectation & standard for QC, and it’s their intent to improve QC even more! We felt it was plenty fine as it was in 2016/2017 BUT we certainly support this impressive effort to improve further. We are excited for our future with Heritage Guitars and are keen to see & play 2018 models, with the focus on even finer QC. Improving an already great Guitar can’t be bad.
So, stay tuned, check out our inventory, and please keep the faith. Heritage and Wolfe Guitars appreciate your loyalty and business.
Sincerely, Jay Wolfe."

 

 

This is not the end of anything. They are going to make the "standard  line" for a few month in order to supply the new dealers with  guitars. After that they will return to making the other models and custom orders.

 

7 hours ago, big bob said:

Heritage is making the standard line exclusively for a short period so they can stock the new dealers. Then it’s back to what ever you can dream up. 

Man, it really should be clear by NOW that they're going to stock their overseas outlets, of which Kuok must have more than a few.  I agree that they'll get back to making Millie's and Archtops and truly gorgeous creations.  I wonder what the buy-in is for a dealership outside the US.

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Hope folks are right that this is temporary.  But, as they say, I have a bad feeling about this.  Othwerise, to paraprhase Reagan, "I didn't leave Heritage, Heritage abandoned me". 

I've been a a Heritage fanatic since 2007, my main gigging guitars are a Super Eagle and a 525, and I've owned a Groovemaster and 575 in the past.  I've performed in 5 countries in three continents, including Singapore, with my Heritages.   And, I've made a point to promote the brand whenever I got the inevitable questions about what guitar I was playing.

 

I accept the need for change.  I've spent 8 of the last ten years working on trade and economic issues in Southeast Asia, and lived in China for two years before that.  I am well aware that the Asia Pacific region is where the growing markets of new expanding middle classes will be found for the foreseeable future.  I also am not some lunatic that thinks magic fairy dust is being lost by bringing the plant up to OSHA standards.  I understand that a business model based on the immortality of 80 year old artisans is not sustainable.  Likewise, I accept that the new owners have sunk a lot of costs into upgrading the plant and have every right to try and recoup those funds and earn a profit.  The increased costs for customization last year were  understandable, though I think an unfortunate abandonment of one of the key appeals of the brand.  Finally, it's reasonable to cancel models that never sold more than single digits, if at all.  But this latest decision seems excessive, extending to some of the company's more popular models,  and I worry that the fundamental DNA of Heritage is being lost.

 

Heritage is not, and I doubt will ever be, a lifestyle brand like Gibson or Harley.  It's always been a boutique company making factory produced hand made guitars in small numbers with an increased attention to craftsmanship and quality.  They're player guitars, not collector guitars.  I have my doubts about the ability to changes this: those willing to pay twice as much for nostalgia will look elsewhere.  Yes, there is the mystique of the original owners.  But, there really  haven't been many options for an affordable players Gibson style arch top guitar, especially with carved tops.  Except for Campellone, almost all of today's boutique builders follow in Bob Benedetto's shadow.  Those are fantastic instruments, but they are very different in construction and sound from a classic L5 or Super 400.  As for Gibson Custom Shop....

 

I'm not a builder, but I'm not sure how much they save with this limitation.  An Eagle Classic (still offered) is a 17"X 3" guitar with parallel bracing and set in pickups.  The Golden Eagle has the same dimensions but X bracing and, most often a floating pickup.  A 575 has a 16" X 2.75" body, with a carved maple top, parallel bracing, and set in pickups.  A Sweet 16 has the same dimensions but the longer neck (same as the Golden Eagle/Eagle Classic), parallel bracing, a spruce top, and a floating pickup.  If the jigs are same, do these differences really complicate manufacturing that much? We're not talking about Foxconn here, but a small factory in Michigan with only tens of employees.  THey're presumably going to be making the same models in the same work spaces rather than having entire production lines, or buildings reserved for separate models.  I'm curious as to what any luthiers on the forum think about this. 

    

The new owners seem to be using PRS as a model: going from a small boutique brand favored by players not satisfied with the current offerings of the iconic companies to becoming a global brand themselves.  That will certainly be easier to do with the HS-150s and 535 semi-bodies that are both easier to make and have bigger potential markets than the arch tops.  I don't pretend to know if improved business practices and manufacturing techniques will enable them to scale up that same way without sacrificing quality.  The internet is filled with comments grousing that PRS failed to do so, but the internet is filled with a lot of BS too.  Certainly the Heritage founders always impressed one as scarred by the Norlin experience, blaming the infamous slip in quality during that time to the company ramping up production to meet post-Beatles demand.  I also wonder if becoming a high-volume solid body manufacturer is viable at a time when all the companies they seem to aspire to emulating are hurting.     

 

Again, I'm hoping that this is just a temporary situation while the company upgrades quality control and completes training and mentoring of the new (or newish) workforce.  I had preferred the new owners had adopted Benedetto as a model, keeping manufacturing in the U.S., retaining the legacy and quality of the guitars intact, but boosting growth through better marketing, sales, and management practices.  That company charges a lot more because of the prestige of Benedetto's name.  But, they appear far more financially healthy than Gibson or Fender these days, and certainly don't lack international sales.  Occupying an underserved medium ground of instruments with higher quality than Ibanez or Eastman, and lower prices than Gibson or Benedetto seems like a good, and IMHO more feasible, niche.   But what do I know, I'm just a humble DC swamp creature Hard Bopper.  

 

I wish the new owners the best of luck, but doubt I'm the only long time customer feeling abandoned as the company seems to discard our entire segment of the market to focus on mass production  and marketing exclusively to Rock musicians.  

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On 2/5/2018 at 6:12 PM, notbillgelder said:

 

This is not the end of anything. They are going to make the "standard  line" for a few month in order to supply the new dealers with  guitars. After that they will return to making the other models and custom orders.

 

On 2/5/2018 at 6:57 PM, big bob said:

Heritage is making the standard line exclusively for a short period so they can stock the new dealers. Then it’s back to what ever you can dream up. 

Then why didn't Heritage clearly state this fact.  No matter how you slice it, this was a BIG mistake (if even just a misunderstanding) by the new Corporation.  Why haven't they clearly stated this to the dealers?  If they did, Jay wouldn't be going off like this.  Guy would know what the hell is going on.   They need to make an official announcement to clear up this sh!t storm they started (even if unintentionally). 

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I was at the first PSP back in 2008.  We had a group photo with the names of the people who were there printed at the bottom of the photo.  We had one of these photos for every year until the ownership changed.  The new owners had a pro cameraman to take the photos and do the same but they didn't.  I told many of you here that the, "quaintness," of Heritage Guitars had disappeared for me.  I could feel it.  It wasn't just the photo.  It was the mojo... and it had left the building -literally. 

I do not feel let down by this.  It is a natural course of life.  I enjoyed it while and when I could.  Things change.  One thing that puts me off is the arguing amongst friends here.  There is no reason for this. 

In 2008 I carried a small jar of red Alabama dirt to PSP1.  An old man there loved the gift.  He had grown up in north Alabama and farmed that red clay.  He isn't there now.  He and Heritage Guitar have moved on.  The new owner would be unimpressed if I gave him that tiny jar of red dirt.  There goes the hardworking soul of Heritage Guitar... dirty fingers and all. 

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I think everyone is overreacting

it's a challenge to build enough gtrs to have representation in all the new retails spaces, in such a short time

so they are focusing on building enough of the "standard" popular models as efficiently as possible: thus no options

in a year we'll probably have the custom options back for anyone who wants them, and more archtops

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, TalismanRich said:

Not to be contrary, but how is Jay "going off"?     He clearly states that this is a limited time deal.   

 

Rich, I didn't mean Jay is "going off" as in a fit of rage.  I meant that he wouldn't have had to "go off" and make a public statement explaining the state of uncertainty of certain models and the uncertain of time frames. 

I apologize if I made it look like Jay was "going off" in a negative manor.  

What I was try to convey is that Guy has publicly said he wished he had better answers to what is going on with Heritage so dealers aren't put in a position to guess what the SOP is when explaining time frames, custom orders, and models available  to their customers.  

Bottom line is Heritage should come out with an official announcement that is more accurate, but hey, it's their company.  Obviously, this is only my opinion and others may vary.

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On ‎2‎/‎5‎/‎2018 at 12:30 PM, yoslate said:

Matt...good to see you're still upright and taking nourishment!  Hope all's well with you!  Not really an arch top player, per se, I do have a custom ordered Super Eagle.  It's an incredible example of the luthier's art!  I've always loved the inherent grace and beauty of arch tops, and what accomplished players (like Matt) could do with them.  And compared to what the equivalent Gibson would have cost ten years ago, I stole my Super (thanks, Jay)!  It's clear that Heritage couldn't continue to build high-end, labor and skill intensive instruments and virtually give them away.  I also don't think it's clear that Heritage has abandoned the building of arch tops, categorically.  We might hope that as they retool, figure out what their market is, and how to address that market's requirements that they'll return to something they did extraordinarily well and had over almost every other builder.  I'd hate to see the art, craft and tradition of a rare and beautiful skill die at the hands of "market forces."  

I have a custom 550 and a 574 and I am happy I have the two of those. They both scratch the itch when I want to play jazzy stuff.

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6 hours ago, High Flying Bird said:

I was at the first PSP back in 2008.  We had a group photo with the names of the people who were there printed at the bottom of the photo.  We had one of these photos for every year until the ownership changed.  The new owners had a pro cameraman to take the photos and do the same but they didn't.  I told many of you here that the, "quaintness," of Heritage Guitars had disappeared for me.  I could feel it.  It wasn't just the photo.  It was the mojo... and it had left the building -literally. 

I do not feel let down by this.  It is a natural course of life.  I enjoyed it while and when I could.  Things change.  One thing that puts me off is the arguing amongst friends here.  There is no reason for this. 

In 2008 I carried a small jar of red Alabama dirt to PSP1.  An old man there loved the gift.  He had grown up in north Alabama and farmed that red clay.  He isn't there now.  He and Heritage Guitar have moved on.  The new owner would be unimpressed if I gave him that tiny jar of red dirt.  There goes the hardworking soul of Heritage Guitar... dirty fingers and all. 

Do you think the new owner would appreciate a small jar of Florida sand?

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I can see why they would suspend production on their least selling guitars until they get their house in order. I would hope they would bring back the models afterwards. Or at least make them to order instead of making them on the production line. Although they are great guitars I don't think the market for jazz boxes is anywhere near the market for the models they are going to continue. 

It's possible that a year from now we wont recognize the company that we all love as they are changing to hit a wider market.  We'll wait and see. Glad I got my custom order Prospect when I did!!

 

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Hi guys- Although I did not post this information here, I certainly don't mind the re-posing of this accurate and up to date info. I actually asked Heritage to post an explanation to this forum and they have thus far not done so. Only thing is I didn't say Heritage was "ending" archtop production, as Bill & some others have kindly pointed out. My post was on my own social media and states that Heritage's current position seems temporary- according to them- and there are 2 archtops on the current 2018 lineup. I posted this explanation because I'd received a number of calls regarding changes, and I found myself on the phone explaining what Heritage perhaps should've explained themselves. The post was intended to inform, and it seems to have accomplished that. There are some updates also to my little post: 1. Heritage traditionally had almost zero biz in California, until Greg DeLorto took it upon himself to canvass that huge State and establish an impressive Dealer network. For his trouble, he has been dismissed. I find this sad and poorly done. 2. Heritage purchased the NAMM PLEK Station, and it should be operational  sometime in March. As a PLEK owner/Tech, I am a BIG believer in this amazing tool and am glad they've made this significant upgrade. I believe Heritage's future looks very good and I am placing orders with them almost daily.

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5 hours ago, Kuz said:

What I was try to convey is that Guy has publicly said he wished he had better answers to what is going on with Heritage so dealers aren't put in a position to guess what the SOP is when explaining time frames, custom orders, and models available  to their customers. 

I have had zero communication with Bandlab corp. You guys know as much as I. No Options, No custom orders... Jay  just confirmed it
H-137 in 2 colors
H-150 in 4 color
H-535 in 4 color
H-530 in 3 colors
H-575 in 2 colors
Eagle Classic in ALSB

Time will tell us everything we need to know, no need to worry.  I am sure the new business model is designed to make Heritage more prosperous for all invested.

Thanks Jay for letting us know about the plek

18 minutes ago, jaywolfe said:

Heritage purchased the NAMM PLEK Station

 

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1 hour ago, jaywolfe said:

Hi guys- Although I did not post this information here, I certainly don't mind the re-posing of this accurate and up to date info. I actually asked Heritage to post an explanation to this forum and they have thus far not done so. Only thing is I didn't say Heritage was "ending" archtop production, as Bill & some others have kindly pointed out. My post was on my own social media and states that Heritage's current position seems temporary- according to them- and there are 2 archtops on the current 2018 lineup. I posted this explanation because I'd received a number of calls regarding changes, and I found myself on the phone explaining what Heritage perhaps should've explained themselves. The post was intended to inform, and it seems to have accomplished that. There are some updates also to my little post: 1. Heritage traditionally had almost zero biz in California, until Greg DeLorto took it upon himself to canvass that huge State and establish an impressive Dealer network. For his trouble, he has been dismissed. I find this sad and poorly done. 2. Heritage purchased the NAMM PLEK Station, and it should be operational  sometime in March. As a PLEK owner/Tech, I am a BIG believer in this amazing tool and am glad they've made this significant upgrade. I believe Heritage's future looks very good and I am placing orders with them almost daily.

Thanks for the info, Jay.

Best wishes to Greg and his family.

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Hey everybody, 

I hope no-one minds me jumping in and saying hello.

Our wonderful people in communications will probably be upset with me when they wake up :P but I wanted to make sure I drop you guys a note as soon as possible about some of the questions about the product line-up. This forum is an incredible community and it's always scary to jump in, so please be nice - I'll do my best to try and earn your respect.

Before I answer the two big issues - it's important to mention that management at Heritage has agreed on only one goal for 2018 - to take our quality standards to the next level. I'm proud that this is the singular focus and everyone is onboard. It's probably too much information, but we've actively made the decision to produce fewer guitars than before, but to make sure they are all amazing instruments, great for the player who owns it and a boon to the dealer who has to sell it. We don't want the channel to be full of guitars that people cannot sell, we want to make sure that the business is healthy and sustainable for the future. I can confirm what Jay said - that we are bringing back the PLEK machine to help us not only raise the quality level of our set-up and fretwork, but also to scan each and every one to identify things that we could do better and seek to improve in the way we build instruments.

With that in mind:

1) We are not ending arch-top production. The standard line-up contains 2 arch-tops and more will definitely be added back in the future. 

2) Custom guitars and shapes that are not on the standard line-up are absolutely not going away - this is the history and heritage (pun sheepishly intended) of the brand - but Jay is correct that they are not going to be available to dealers for the time being. What is being worked on and a big priority is how to offer customisation efficiently to dealers and consumers and announcements will be coming shortly.

We've been working on getting really clear messaging together so there is no confusion, and difficult decisions have had to be made with our channel and product strategy but we believe we're all trying to make sure everything we love here is around for the next 100 years. There's been a tremendous amount going on post-NAMM, but that's no excuse and I personally and sincerely apologise that communication from Heritage hasn't been as good as one would expect. We are working hard on making it better. There will be lots of communication to come, and we're getting our ducks in a row to make sure things can move as smoothly as possible - as mentioned there will be announcements coming on the custom program. As a company and an ongoing business I hope you guys understand that there will be some things we can answer and some things that we can't - but if anyone PMs me, I will do my best to try and answer questions in a timely manner.

I really hope this has been helpful - thank you to everyone for making the brand truly special.

Yours respectfully,

Meng

p.s: that jar of red Alabama dirt sounds like a really thoughtful gift - definitely not unimpressed. :)

p.p.s: there has been speculation that Heritage would create a cheaper line of import guitars - this is not the plan. In my humble opinion, a Heritage guitar made outside of 225 Parsons Street, Kalamazoo is not a Heritage guitar.

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