jamison162 Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 I've got a set of 18:1 locking rotomatics lying around. Has anyone replaced your stock Grover tuners with these on an H-150? If so, how do you like them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doggy1972 Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 I have an H170. Put grover lockers on straight away. Theyve really improved the tuning stability. Stays in tune forever, ever with vicious bends. They also make it easier to string (cos Im lazy and a bit of a klutz) :- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul P Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 I also think they're great. If you don't have the instructions they can be found by going to : http://www.grotro.com/Mainlockingroto.html then selecting "Instructions for using grover lockers". I think you should follow them. The high E string can be a bit of a problem, and must be more so with light strings, since it tends to slip intead of getting jammed in the post like it's supposed to. I wrap the string around my fingers and pull fairly hard until the mechanism gets its grip. You should end up with less than one turn on the posts. I cut the strings off about a 1/4" from the post and bend the end down so as not to get stabbed by it. Paul P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul144 Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 If you string your guitar correctly, no need for locking tuners even on a trem guitar. Just bend the string under your wind, that effectively locks the string. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamison162 Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 If you string your guitar correctly, no need for locking tuners even on a trem guitar. Just bend the string under your wind, that effectively locks the string. True, but for me that's not the issue. Quick and easy string changes, plus no worry about slippage if I don't string it right. Break a string at a gig, I can have a new one on a stretched in even quicker, no foolin around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PacerX Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 If you string your guitar correctly, no need for locking tuners even on a trem guitar. Just bend the string under your wind, that effectively locks the string. False. No matter how you tie it (I tie mine on non-lockers), it's going to slip some. The more string around the peg, the more prone it is to slippage initially, and the longer it will take to get all that slack out and make the string go "solid" (it behaves a lot like a spring... many of which in industry are made of "music wire"... yep... basically untinned guitar string material). Lockers basically have no winds to allow slippage, and less string means less slack to take up also - because of the nature of static vs. sliding friction, the string around a non-locking tuning peg will "stutter" it's way to equilibrium in a rather haphazard way. Physics is a cruel mistress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazwell Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 I have a set of the Grover Locking tuners. They are very nice and although I never was one to attempt to bend strings around, I never had too big of a tuning problem prior. The Grovers do seem to keep the guitar in even better tune, and I also ordered the model with the higher gear ratio for more accuracy. Only thing I found, and this is a small gripe, is they stick out a bit further than the standard Grovers. Aside from that, I think they are great-and very easy to install as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul144 Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Been playing 35 years. Have locking tuners and non locking. If you wind strings around a locking tuner, you're asking for slippage, they are not designed to be wrapped that way. You still have to stretch the strings when they are tuned to pitch in 3 places, near the nut, then retune, near the 12th fret, then retune, and over the bridge pickup, then retune. Any further tuning issues will most likely be due to a sticky nut, otherwise the guitar should have close to zero slippage, even with a non locking tuner with the string bent under and then wrapped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PacerX Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Been playing 35 years. Have locking tuners and non locking. If you wind strings around a locking tuner, you're asking for slippage, they are not designed to be wrapped that way. You still have to stretch the strings when they are tuned to pitch in 3 places, near the nut, then retune, near the 12th fret, then retune, and over the bridge pickup, then retune. Any further tuning issues will most likely be due to a sticky nut, otherwise the guitar should have close to zero slippage, even with a non locking tuner with the string bent under and then wrapped. Been playing 29, have a mechanical engineering degree, and have done research & development work for a guitar string manufacturer. You're going to get more instability out of having more string in the system - lockers positively ARE more stable, carry the further benefit of faster string changes, and more precise tuning because, again, there's less string in the system. If it ain't there, it can't slip or stick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamison162 Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 Been playing 35 years. Have locking tuners and non locking. If you wind strings around a locking tuner, you're asking for slippage, they are not designed to be wrapped that way. That's exactly the point here and why locking tuners are more stable. Noone siad anything about wrapping a locking tuner; we were talking traditional tuners and why/how locking tuners are better. Not to confuse the debate here...just trying to clarify for those late to the party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundersteel Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 I've been playing for close to 30 years, and I've never had locking tuners. I've never had tuning problems, either; even with Klusons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamison162 Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 I've been playing for close to 30 years, and I've never had locking tuners. I've never had tuning problems, either; even with Klusons. You Win!!!!!! Seriously though, never tried them then you don't know what you're missing hehehe. I wouldn't have a strat type guitar without them. The Gotoh locking Klusons on my Grosh are probably the best tuners I've used. I love those things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuz Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Let's see how many legendary guitar heroes have managed to survive with out locking tuners.... They are a convenience. Almost all my guitar are stoptails, plus a Tele and Strat (block tremolo). I don't feel qualified to answer if locking tuners are a must for "wiggly bar" guitars so I'll bail out on trem guitars. 4 of 6 PRS guitars that I used to own (still have three- 2 with locking tuners, 1 without) had locking tuners. I had a G&L with loking tuners. I have owned over 20 other guitars without locking tuners. POINT, other than convenience, I can't tell the difference. If strung & stretched correctly they stay in tune equally as well. Locking tuners also used to be way to heavy and make the guitar head heavy. If Larry Carton, Robben Ford, and Al DiMeola have managed to somehow get along without locking tuners, I a hack like me can make do without. Stringing a guitar, the lost art. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skydog Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 I think we're getting away from the OP's question. I've had the Gotoh locking tuners on a few guitars. They are a matter of convenience. They make string changes a snap. With regards to some of the other posts, IMHO there are a few different ways of winding a post that help eliminate slippage there. I've found the most tuning instability with new strings when stretching occurs. This will happen with locker or standard tuners. Perhaps the most notorious string bender is BB King. His tech wraps the ENTIRE string on the post. Looks hideous and unnecessary. But who am I to argue w/ the KING! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamison162 Posted March 21, 2008 Author Share Posted March 21, 2008 Yeah, this thread wasn't to start a debate on locking vs. traditional tuners. If locking tuners went away or were never invented that's fine too. I don't have to have them. I was mainly interested in discussing the tuners mentioned and get input from anyone actually using these exact tuners. I could have been asking about any specific tuner, locking or otherwise. I know everyone has there opinion...this is one of those topics you can't bring up without starting a debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacques Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 What is more important: 1. are the locking tuners the same weight as the originals? Different weight means different tone. 2. will they fit in all the orginal holes? Indeed stringing up your giuitar in the right way (including the stretching) helps a lot, but locking tuners are just more convenient, so what the heck if you like that! What I had with my old faithfull 150 the other day was it kept going out of tune all the time due to temperature differences. There's not much you can do to that (unless you've got plenty of time to let the guitar sit in the new environment for an hour or so). Locking or non locking tuners don't make any difference in such a situation.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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