My H-150 Gets a Makeover

[smurph1]

It is YOUR guitar after all,Scott..It's just that what I think slips out of my pie hole sometimes..rock on, and may we be friends forever..Scott

[rjsanders]

...

 

Really guys, this was meant as a compliment. I am sorry to have angered any one you. Please accept my sincere apologies. And if Marv, Jim, Vince, JP, Bill any of the crew at Parsons Street ever get wind of this, please let them know that I meant it as a complement to them.

 

 

 

Sincerely, Scott

 

Welcome, Scott. xlnt work & i dig the compliment. also, i agree w/you on the cutaway (& i have a 137 & a 157 & 2 LPs) - better feel & access for me.

 

a '71-'72 "clownburst" Deluxe was my 2nd LP, bought new, sold a couple-few yrs ago. if it'd had that nice finish of yours, i mighta kept it. played & sounded fine + had those mini-hums...

[Guest mgoetting]

I don't get this love of vintage Gibsons.

 

Are today's woods inferior to those of 1958? Have millions of years old tree DNAs mutated recently?

 

Has metallurgy gone stupid?

 

Are craftsman less dedicated and skilled?

 

How could our space program, military, food science and technology, sports performances, cars, etc. get better the last 50 years but our guitars get worse and worse?

 

I understand how someone might want to collect stuff, like stamps, coins, cars and guitars. But for sound and playing, I'm not buying this nostalgia. Literally, I'm not buying it.

 

I've owned many early Gibson electrics, dozens. They were great guitars. But there isn't one of the ES-3xx series or LPs that I liked better than my H555 or H150.

 

We have better new guitars to choose from today than any other time. You need to know how to find them among the lesser quality pieces. Heritage is one of the best sources. It looks like G&L and PRS may also be.

[Patrick]

Dont be upset or depressed. No one here can speak for the guys at Heritage. I cant even begin know to what they would think about your mods or any of the posts on this thread. It really is your guitar to do what you want.

Youve done great work. Be happy about it. I would be.

 

tully . . . most of us here know the guys at Heritage pretty well . . . some better than others. I don't want to make Scott feel worse than he already does, but trust me on this, they would not be happy. However, they would recognize that Scott's alterations of their beloved head stock was well intended. Hell, if they saw his skill level, they'd probably try to hire him. Also, they are a little sensitive about this type of direct duplication of a Gibson design due to the law suit for copyright infringement they went through a few years back. If Fender didn't come to their financial rescue they'd all be doing something different today.

 

It's clear that Scott meant no harm and was well intended. As his penance, I suggest that he orders a custom made H150, made to his own specifications . . . . with the standard Heritage head stock.

[ExNihilo]

There was a fantastic post on another forum a while back where a guy in the middle east recreated a burst in a start to finish build thread of the most accurate detail. It would be interesting to get his take on how faithfully a 150 comes to his present day "grail" vs a Gibson Historic. Should the only appreciable difference be color/fad, hardware and headstock, that would be just a super appreciation for Heritage. We can change the hardware and the headstock was an improvement.

 

Here are some pictures of some guitars I have built:

 

A 1958:

 

 

A 1959:

 

 

 

Another 1959:

 

 

A custom LP Style Guitar:

 

 

One of my guitars is featured on the Sheptone pickup website (the first one is one of my guitars): My link

 

You can see some tutorials I made on how to build guitars:

 

 

 

 

So, I think I can answer the above question both impartially and with some expertise.

 

The Gibson historics, by and large (IMHO) are made from less quality wood than the Heritage guitars I have handled (which has been very limited (5-8?). The guitar I bought has great wood. A Gibson historic looks closer to a burst (obviously), but is still not totally accurate (see my video tutorials).

 

The fit and finish on G. Historics are more consistent than Heritage, but that is because more computers are involved (which I don't like).

 

On my Heritage, The Mahogany was colored by the lacquer and not the grain filler (which I don't like). And my H-150 did not have a long tenon. And I like the holly veneer and MOP logo on Gibsons.

 

As someone who knows how to build a guitar I can tell you with certainty that the question "Which is better" or "Which has higher quality" does not have a black and white answer. I will say that I like the Heritage guitars much better. I usually like about 1 out of 10 Gibson historics. (and they are the ones that are about $5K). I imagine that my "like ratio" would be much higher with Heritage (5-6 out of 10? Remember, I am VERY picky). I could never say I like any guitar just because it was made by a certain manufacture. Guitars are not guns. They are instruments and many factors must combine to make a great guitar.

 

However, the bottom line is: Heritage makes great guitars. For the money, they are some of the best I have seen.

 

Sincerely, Scott

[ExNihilo]

Spectrum . . . they are different guitars in more ways than hardware and head stock design. They are dimensionally different . . . the 150 is smaller, the neck tenons are different, the top carve (dish) is different, the cut away is different. The things that make an original '59 burst can all be replicated to perfection . . . as that guy you referenced in Israel did, and as Scott probably does. What can never be replicated is the mojo and the vibe that one gets from having a "real" one. If Heritage chose to replicate to 100% accuracy the 1959 burst, they could do so pretty easily. That was not their intention. They wanted to make a Heritage LP shaped guitar and they did so. The nice thing about the 150s, is that they vary all over the board as much as the original '59s did. I think that's the character we all love.

 

FANTASTIC POST! That is exactly correct! Thank you.

[rjsanders]

I don't get this love of vintage Gibsons.

 

Are today's woods inferior to those of 1958? Have millions of years old tree DNAs mutated recently?

 

...

 

 

note that Brazilian rosewood and some mahoganies are extremely limited, some no longer available legally. just examples. great tone woods are available, but sometimes not the ones used in times past. and certainly the big factories crank out a lot of guits with inferior wood.

[Patrick]

I don't get this love of vintage Gibsons.

 

Are today's woods inferior to those of 1958? Have millions of years old tree DNAs mutated recently?

 

Has metallurgy gone stupid?

 

Are craftsman less dedicated and skilled?

 

How could our space program, military, food science and technology, sports performances, cars, etc. get better the last 50 years but our guitars get worse and worse?

 

I understand how someone might want to collect stuff, like stamps, coins, cars and guitars. But for sound and playing, I'm not buying this nostalgia. Literally, I'm not buying it.

 

I've owned many early Gibson electrics, dozens. They were great guitars. But there isn't one of the ES-3xx series or LPs that I liked better than my H555 or H150.

 

We have better new guitars to choose from today than any other time. You need to know how to find them among the lesser quality pieces. Heritage is one of the best sources. It looks like G&L and PRS may also be.

 

Mark . . . I've met you personally. I've dined with you. We had a chance to chat, in person, long enough for me to appreciate the you are an intelligent man. As such . . . I choose to not believe the first sentence of this post. Of course you "get the love of vintage Gibsons". That's why you love current Heritages. For the most part, they're vintage Gibsons (to Scott's original point) without the hefty price tag caused by the sought after collectible aspect of the vintage Gibson. As for the sound and playability, as I said earlier . . . all of that can be easily replicated, and it is being done so by companies like Heritage. However, the coolness, the vibe, the mojo, the allure . . . if I was still gigging, and I had my choice to be performing with the Brock Burst . . . arguably a $1,000,000 drop dead beautiful Les Paul, or a current . . . . anything . . . . what do you think I'm gonna choose???

[NoNameBand]

We know that Imitation is the greatest form of flattery and I'm sure it is well intended. I don't mean to beat a tired horse, but being as you're in the business of building and selling guitars, I believe there may be an issue or claim of Trademark infringement. I wonder what the attorneys at Gibson and Heritage would say about this issue? Needless to say, I know Gibson would be upset and I'm sure it would put the Guys at Heritage on the defense if the guitar were sold. You might want to get an opinion from both Gibson & Heritage before you sell the guitar and/or consider changing the Logo to your own.

[FredZepp]

BTW, Scott, that's some nice guitar porn that you posted. Sweet.

 

And I love Sheptones.

I played my 157 w Sheptones yesterday and it is so... alive.

 

 

And the back of the headstock that you posted has some great looking mahogany.

[ExNihilo]

We know that Imitation is the greatest form of flattery and I'm sure it is well intended. I don't mean to beat a tired horse, but being as you're in the business of building and selling guitars, I believe there may be an issue or claim of Trademark infringement. I wonder what the attorneys at Gibson and Heritage would say about this issue? Needless to say, I know Gibson would be upset and I'm sure it would put the Guys at Heritage on the defense if the guitar were sold. You might want to get an opinion from both Gibson & Heritage before you sell the guitar and/or consider changing the Logo to your own.

 

 

Oh, you are quite correct. It was absolutely wrong of me to build these replicas (including the Gibson logo). I do not do it anymore. And I would NEVER try to defend the practice at all. I definitely have my own "ExNihilo" logo and headstock shape. I only posted these to show you some of my past work to prove that I was not trying to make my guitar look like a Gibson, or to insult Heritage.

 

My final word on the matter is: I love Heritage guitars. I changed my headstock as a tribute to Heritage, not Gibson.

 

Again, I am really sorry if I got off on the wrong foot here. My H-150 is my favorite guitar I have ever owned.... I would never sell it. That says a lot!

[Guest mgoetting]

Mark . . . I've met you personally. I've dined with you. We had a chance to chat, in person, long enough for me to appreciate the you are an intelligent man. As such . . . I choose to not believe the first sentence of this post. Of course you "get the love of vintage Gibsons". That's why you love current Heritages. For the most part, they're vintage Gibsons (to Scott's original point) without the hefty price tag caused by the sought after collectible aspect of the vintage Gibson. As for the sound and playability, as I said earlier . . . all of that can be easily replicated, and it is being done so by companies like Heritage. However, the coolness, the vibe, the mojo, the allure . . . if I was still gigging, and I had my choice to be performing with the Brock Burst . . . arguably a $1,000,000 drop dead beautiful Les Paul, or a current . . . . anything . . . . what do you think I'm gonna choose???

 

I get how some like the historic aspects. My point is that today's guitars can be as good as or better than those made back then.

 

Some of us search for a mojo factor, which is impossible to clearly describe. I'm okay with that concept. It's intuitive. And it cannot be detected the same way by everyone. Just like falling in love I suppose.

 

I had to snicker a few days ago. I saw a Strat RI that was "road worn" by Fender. I liked it because I would never have to worry about dinging or scratching it. But I didn't like the idea that I'd be paying someone to beat up a perfectly good guitar. I know people are attracted to this type of guitar because it looks like it must have mojo. How crazy is that?

 

Back to the OP. Some of you guys wouldn't be nominated for the welcoming committee. But then this forum isn't for the faint of heart.

 

Those are beautiful replicas BTW.

 

I wonder about patent infringement in making replicas. Maybe someone here is a lawyer. I think Gibson or Heritage could maybe get a cease and desist order, but that would cost them time and money. And they would need to show damages if they sue for money. There are little or no negative financial implications from a solo luthier making Gibson or Heritage knock offs. So I wonder how that would play out. I doubt either company would bother.

[rjsanders]

Oh, you are quite correct. It was absolutely wrong of me to build these replicas (including the Gibson logo). I do not do it anymore. And I would NEVER try to defend the practice at all. I definitely have my own "ExNihilo" logo and headstock shape. I only posted these to show you some of my past work to prove that I was not trying to make my guitar look like a Gibson, or to insult Heritage.

 

My final word on the matter is: I love Heritage guitars. I changed my headstock as a tribute to Heritage, not Gibson.

 

Again, I am really sorry if I got off on the wrong foot here. My H-150 is my favorite guitar I have ever owned.... I would never sell it. That says a lot!

 

 

xlnt! play in good health!

 

 

my final word (maybe. anyway, an alternative to fondness for ice cream):

 

 

[Kuz]

Well, it seems I did exactly what I did not intend to do. So, I hope I can explain my reasoning.

I am not trying to boast, but you must realize that I have built several extremely high end LP replicas. The ones I have built go far beyond any Gibson historic/VOS. Mine are replicas to the finest detail. The guitars I build would be considered way beyond a Heritage or a Gibson. (I know some of you might be mad to hear me say that) You might wonder why I don't just stick with my own guitars rather than get a Heritage? The answer is obvious. Because I love the guitar, where it was made, and who made it.

 

Now, let me explain specifically my reasoning behind the headstock change. Far from being an insult to Heritage. I view it as the highest form of praise to Heritage and a complete slam against Gibson. I view Heritage as the TRUE Gibson. So, I gave my Heritage an open-book headstock (the hallmark of Gibson) as a way of saying: "This is a real LP". In fact, that is why I bought it.... because it is the real LP (and that is why I put the name "The Heritage" on it!). So, I really think you have my intentions turned completely upside down.

 

This is not about me wanting a guitar that looks like a Gibson. It's about me having a piece of the real mojo of the 58-60 LP Standard. For YEARS Gibson has been hounding people about copying their headstock.... Well, whose copying who? That is my statement in changing my headstock.

 

Wow, I am sorry but without playing your guitars, I find this statement a little arrogant. Personally, this arrogant self-indulgent comment makes it hard for me to take the rest of your comment's serious. Maybe your guitars are good or even great, but I don't know of any other luthiers that would be so boastful (actually, most well known guitar makers that I have dealt with make it a point to not be critical of other companies guitars) .

 

I have played MANY MANY different Single Cut LP styles of guitars and only Terry McInturrff's Carolina Custom guitars are on par with my Heritages.

 

Sometimes a little humility goes a long way....

 

Just my .02

[smurph1]

I LOVE ICE CREAM!! I'm GONNA GO GET ME A BLIZZARD!! Sorry Scott you are welcome here..Let's just make a choice to forget the last couple hours and we're all good!!

[ExNihilo]

I find this statement a little arrogant... I don't know of any other luthiers that would be so boastful (actually, most well known guitar makers that I have dealt with make it a point to not be critical of other companies guitars).... Sometimes a little humility goes a long way....

 

Just my .02

 

I was not trying to boast. I only said that because that is what those who have bought my guitars say. I do realize it sounds like boasting.... Again, not my intent.

 

I think perhaps it would be best that I just not post here anymore. It seems everything I say here ends up going the wrong way.

 

I just want you to know that I love and respect Heritage guitars. I am a happy and proud owner of one. And I am sorry to have ruffled feathers.

 

 

Sincerely, Scott

[NoNameBand]

Scott, I'm sorry if you come away from this feeling bad. You of all people should appreciate the loyalty that the HOC has for their Heritage guitars. Don't be surprised by the reactions any more than if you were "The Heritage" and some really talented guy modified something you were very proud of. Clearly, you are proud of your work and you should be and you were not expecting the reaction you got. You shouldn't be disappointed that everyone did not embrace all of your choices equally. Thats the way family is, honest, even to a fault. We are not judging you, just some of us disagree with you on something. Thats it. Don't take it personally. We don't when others disagree with us. I always say, "if two people agree on everything, one of them isn't necessary". You can't expect everyone to agree on everything.

Tomorrow's another day.

[rjsanders]

I was not trying to boast. I only said that because that is what those who have bought my guitars say. I do realize it sounds like boasting.... Again, not my intent.

 

I think perhaps it would be best that I just not post here anymore....

 

Sincerely, Scott

 

 

well, i hope you stick around, Scott. a well-informed opinion has value. regardless, enjoy!

[Patrick]

I was not trying to boast. I only said that because that is what those who have bought my guitars say. I do realize it sounds like boasting.... Again, not my intent.

 

I think perhaps it would be best that I just not post here anymore. It seems everything I say here ends up going the wrong way.

 

I just want you to know that I love and respect Heritage guitars. I am a happy and proud owner of one. And I am sorry to have ruffled feathers.

 

 

Sincerely, Scott

 

"You ain't goin' nowhere man"!!! . . . . . this forum is just as addictive as Heritage guitars. You'll be around for a while. It's too much fun here. Even though you pissed off a few people, no one wants you to drop out.

[big bob]

Well, this REALLY upsets and depresses me. That is the LAST thing I would EVER want to do. In fact, I put my Heritage serial number on the back.

 

 

Really guys, this was meant as a compliment. I am sorry to have angered any one you. Please accept my sincere apologies. And if Marv, Jim, Vince, JP, Bill any of the crew at Parsons Street ever get wind of this, please let them know that I meant it as a complement to them.

 

 

 

Sincerely, Scott

 

I would think the guys at Heritage would be rolling with laughter, how funny...

And a great project, keep building/modding we need more of this...

from one builder to another

YOU ROCK

[TalismanRich]

I was not trying to boast. I only said that because that is what those who have bought my guitars say. I do realize it sounds like boasting.... Again, not my intent.

 

I think perhaps it would be best that I just not post here anymore. It seems everything I say here ends up going the wrong way.

 

I just want you to know that I love and respect Heritage guitars. I am a happy and proud owner of one. And I am sorry to have ruffled feathers.

 

 

Sincerely, Scott

 

Don't worry about ruffling a few feathers. You won't be the first or the last, on this or any other forum. Stick around and contribute. I think having more luthiers is a great thing. We've got a few, and some amp builders. The fact that you appreciate the effort and the authenticity of the Heritage means a lot.

 

Your replicas are very nice looking. There are a few in the group who have custom made 58 or 59 replicas. That seems to be all the rage now.

 

I wonder sometimes about the legalities of replicas. When is it a ghost builder, a custom builder and a trademark infringement? There are tons of "Stratocasters" that never saw a Fender factory. Guys like Suhr and Anderson make guitars that are a lot closer to a Fender than a Les Paul is to the PRS single cut that Gibson sued over (and ultimately lost).

 

BTW, for the record, I like clown burst!

[Guest mgoetting]

I was not trying to boast. I only said that because that is what those who have bought my guitars say. I do realize it sounds like boasting.... Again, not my intent.

 

I think perhaps it would be best that I just not post here anymore. It seems everything I say here ends up going the wrong way.

 

I just want you to know that I love and respect Heritage guitars. I am a happy and proud owner of one. And I am sorry to have ruffled feathers.

 

 

Sincerely, Scott

 

 

Folks here get nicer as time goes on. Well, maybe not.

 

You'd be a very valuable resource to the HOC members, so I hope you tune in.

[smurph1]

Yeah!!Plus I live in West Virginia!! I don't know anything! LOL

[NoNameBand]

Don't worry about ruffling a few feathers. You won't be the first or the last, on this or any other forum. Stick around and contribute. I think having more luthiers is a great thing. We've got a few, and some amp builders. The fact that you appreciate the effort and the authenticity of the Heritage means a lot.

 

Your replicas are very nice looking. There are a few in the group who have custom made 58 or 59 replicas. That seems to be all the rage now.

 

I wonder sometimes about the legalities of replicas. When is it a ghost builder, a custom builder and a trademark infringement? There are tons of "Stratocasters" that never saw a Fender factory. Guys like Suhr and Anderson make guitars that are a lot closer to a Fender than a Les Paul is to the PRS single cut that Gibson sued over (and ultimately lost).

 

BTW, for the record, I like clown burst!

 

How many of those can you fit in to a little car?

[redking]

Wow! You guys are a bunch of douchebags! Was thinking of buying a Heritage....not anymore! Scott is one of the finest luthiers in North America. He knows more about building a "set neck single cut" guitar than anyone on this forum. He offers his hand as a gesture of friendship and you guys absolutely slay him to defend that ugly ass headstock! If Heritage legally "could" make a guitar with the open book headstock, I guaran-damn-tee you they would do it because it is a part of the classic look and feel of those great guitars built in Kalamazoo so long ago.

 

You all suck ass!

 

good bye.